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Thread: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

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    Default Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    I (a Christian) have been dating a Muslim girl for about 4 years.
    Her dad is a Muslim and her mum is a Catholic.
    She hasn't told her parents about us because she is concerned about 'breaking up the family'.

    From my understanding of the Qur'an there shouldn't really be a problem.
    The 2 verses of interest are 2:221 and 5:5.

    I read a post about this here http://www.understanding-islam.org/r...estion&qid=599
    which says
    The case of a Muslim woman marrying a non-Muslim man - except that of prohibiting polytheist men for them - has not been directly covered in the Qur'an . One may hold the opinion that by permitting marriage between Muslim men and Jewish and Christian women, the Qur'an has also permitted marriage between Muslim women and Jewish and Christian men.
    However, a different view is expressed here http://islam.about.com/blinterfaith.htm
    Under no conditions is a Muslim woman permitted to marry anyone but a Muslim man. (2:221) mentions, "Nor marry your girls to unbelievers until they believe. A man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever...."
    This appears to come down to interpretation.
    What is defined as an unbeliever?
    = Not a believer?
    What is a believer?
    = Someone of the book?

    After all, we are all branches of the same tree.
    i.e. decendents of Abraham.

    Can you see an issue with us getting married?

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    When dealing with marriages of differing religions tensions can come about regardless if it is Christian / Muslim relations. Obviously the parents are somewhat tolerant if her mother is a Catholic and her father is a Muslim. yet, if she has been afraid to tell her parents about you two for 4 years, that gives me reason to pause and say to be careful.

    I know the Bible encourages Christians not to be yolked with an unbeliever. My interpertation is that unbeliever is meaning someone who is not a follower of Jesus (Christian), though this can be up for displute, that's the way i understand it (2 Corinthians 6 ). However, it does not forbid such unions. In those cases it encourages the couples to stay together and for the believer (Christian) to remain devoted to God first and devoted in love to the spouse (1 Corinthians 7 ).

    My suggestion is to procede with caution and "lots-o-prayer".
    If we do no believe in descent behavior, why should we be so anxious to make excuses for not having behaved decently?

    "You can not make men good by law: and without good men you can not have a good society."

    ~ C.S. Lewis

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Peace Opticyclic

    I (a Christian) have been dating a Muslim girl for about 4 years
    I find it strange and intriguing, that a Muslim girl, who after 4 years of doing something totally prohibited in her religion, is asking the question of what her religion says about marriage to a Christian.

    Regards

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Thanks for your input Bubba, although I was looking at unbelievers from the Muslim point of view.

    Haroon:
    Quote Originally Posted by Haroon
    Peace Opticyclic

    I find it strange and intriguing, that a Muslim girl, who after 4 years of doing something totally prohibited in her religion, is asking the question of what her religion says about marriage to a Christian.

    Regards
    Like I say, I am struggling to find it written in the Qu'ran where it is written so.

    Can you quote me a passage to clear this up please?

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    One verse that comes to mind off the top of my head is Surah 5:51 Though I'm not keen as to what historical implications it had, or even if that verse is still emphasized today.
    If we do no believe in descent behavior, why should we be so anxious to make excuses for not having behaved decently?

    "You can not make men good by law: and without good men you can not have a good society."

    ~ C.S. Lewis

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Peace Opticyclic

    Of the little time I have, I can give you this:

    "The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication,- flog each of them with a hundred stripes: Let not compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day: and let a party of the Believers witness their punishment." [Surah 24:02]

    The word zina in Arabic means any form of illegal sexual activity, so adultery and fornication. About getting married, well im not one to advise on such an issue. Like i said, even if there was a prohibition on it, why would someone who has been laughing in the face of an even greater prohibition, be interested in it? Is marriage the only time that religion has a part to play?

    Regards

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    Lightbulb Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Peace to all!

    hope everyone's well, inshaallah.

    i have some thoughts which may or may not help. i can understand the weakness in human attraction to te opposite sex, and it really doesn't help when it's difference in religion, cast, colour, ethics, blah blah blah. but the point you might want to ask yourself is this, IF this marriage, bond, whatever this person has with the other, IF it's absolutely destiny then why do you question Allah's will over the happening of it? what i mean is if the girl knows that this marriage to this christian is absolute, then wwhy not just wait for Allah to use His ultimate and infinite wisdom that no human posesses to work a way for this to happen. if it's gonna happen, it will, no doubt, why go and upset the people you love on the way no?
    i myself encountered this and believe me i still am waiting becasue i know what allah chooses for me is by far a greater benefit for me than the choice i would have made.
    i just thought tell your girlfriend that if she wants real help, pray two rakaats of salat-ul-istikharah. basically after the rakaats you ask for Allah (swt)'s blessing in any matter at hand and wait for the blessing and miracles of allah to enfold. (wonderful isn't it us, not only are we given the gift of salah but another gift of solving one's whims and desires)
    Last edited by Kleiderscope Tara; 16th April 2006 at 22:19.
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    Exclamation Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Salam>>>

    Hummmm this is intresting.
    I read the opinions and i can't give any better but i have a question of my own and that i hope will not offend you in anyway, Opticyclic. I was wondering if you ever considered converting to her religion. I mean that could be the best thing to do. Seeing that she prolly is in love with u and all did u two not consider that option? Not only will she gain something out of it but so will you. As I've been told "love someone for the sake of God".
    Again i do hope that this does not offend you in anyway...it's just and opinion and also a personal question.

    salam>>>
    Aliayah Muslimah>>>>>

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Salam All

    Quote Originally Posted by Haroon
    Like i said, even if there was a prohibition on it, why would someone who has been laughing in the face of an even greater prohibition, be interested in it? Is marriage the only time that religion has a part to play?
    This is a very good point.
    I hope that it will be taken up in in the discussion.
    If Opticyclic and girlfriend have been 'dating' for 4 years, then the question of prohibition was not a serious issue.

    Why is it an issue now? Social correctness? A face saving exercise for the sake of the father of the girlfriend? I can, theoretically understand up to a point but not entirely.

    I truly wonder.

    Best Regards

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    Veteran Member MF's Avatar
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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Quote Originally Posted by opticyclic
    I (a Christian) have been dating a Muslim girl for about 4 years.
    Her dad is a Muslim and her mum is a Catholic.
    She hasn't told her parents about us because she is concerned about 'breaking up the family'.

    Can you see an issue with us getting married?
    why would it break up the family if a catholic and a muslim marriage didnt? I think its best if you would have the same religion though, would it matter anything to you to convert to Islam?
    “The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.” ~ Mahatma Gandhi

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Bubba
    One verse that comes to mind off the top of my head is Surah 5:51 Though I'm not keen as to what historical implications it had, or even if that verse is still emphasized today.
    That seems in direct contradiction to Surah 5:5 where you can marry Christians or Jews (People of the book).

    Kleiderscope Tara: I didn't quite follow what you were saying, was it essentially Allah decides what will happen?
    Does that mean that it doesn't matter what you does since Allah will have predestined it to happen?

    Aliayah: She could just as easily convert to mine could she not?

    Quote Originally Posted by KOMMY
    If Opticyclic and girlfriend have been 'dating' for 4 years, then the question of prohibition was not a serious issue.

    Why is it an issue now? Social correctness? A face saving exercise for the sake of the father of the girlfriend? I can, theoretically understand up to a point but not entirely.
    The reason is that she is a bit of a 'buffet Muslim' she is not 100% strict and picks and chooses.

    Quote Originally Posted by MF
    why would it break up the family if a catholic and a muslim marriage didnt?
    I think in the first instance, because it explicitly says in 5:5 that it is OK for a man to marry a Catholic (People of the Book).
    I think her dad is also still guilty about marrying a catholic though and my GF is worried that her doing something similar might upset him even more.
    Maybe he feels he has failed or something
    Quote Originally Posted by MF
    I think its best if you would have the same religion though, would it matter anything to you to convert to Islam?
    I am currently questioning all different religions.
    I would feel less comfortable making a commitment to a different religion than I do with my current one.
    But thats a different thread

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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl


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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Quote Originally Posted by opticyclic
    Can you see an issue with us getting married?
    peace opti...

    i'm sorry to say that i don't see much hope for this. frankly, it looks to me like you're headed for a brick wall at high speed. i'll try to lay out for you why i say that.

    what i've been taught...by a teacher who is among other things a judge in the islamic courts who deals with divorce cases...is that "honor your father and mother" is just about the second commandment in islam. really, it's right up there with "there is no god except God". he gave us a serious harangue on that point a couple summers ago. and i think i understand why.

    a large part of the function of religion on the human plane is to strengthen and safeguard family relations, because they are the taproot of healthy culture. almost everything you are doing is going against that. so you can't afford to underestimate her concerns about her family, not with any justice. these are very valid concerns and very important ones.

    marriage is based in honor. it is sacred. it is holy. and it requires the utmost of politeness and respect in every way. and marriage is not just between two people. many many other people are involved. in a way, you could say it's a marriage of two families. so it's sacred not only because of what is between the heart of the man and the woman and the need to protect the holiness of that, but because it forms the very nucleus of civilized society. therefore it requires honor toward all concerned. it can't begin in a lie, or in avoidance, or in pretense. to be strong, it has to have a solid foundation, no cracks, and no rotting timbers. but she has been effectively lying to her family for 4 years. you both need to find your honor again, and she needs to tell them the truth. for you to try to come up with a religious argument from someone else's religion to justify to her parents what you have been doing...i think you're really missing the point entirely.

    as, i think, is she. she already has broken up her family; she just would rather continue to lie to them about it and avoid the issue. the good news, potentially, is for her and her family: if she is honest with them and really repents from what she's been doing, and if she shows her full heart to her family and chooses to obey her heart in what she knows to be the truth, it could bring her family closer together than it ever has been. there is a deeper trust that can come after betrayal. but honestly i can't see you in this picture at all.

    it is partly as a result of the lack of understanding and concern over these issues generally that western culture is in full decay on every side, and all we need to do to see the results of that is to pick up a newspaper. traditionally a man goes to a woman's father to ask his permission to marry her...or even to court her. this is a very beautiful thing, and for a father's daughter, these days, to insist that a potential suitor do things in this traditional way...this is the greatest gift she can give her father, to allow him to play the protective role that his heart wants and deserves. to do otherwise is to deprive him of this gift, and she knows this. in this case her parents are a symbol of her integrity that she has lost touch with. that's why you haven't already eloped. it's because her heart knows better; she doesn't want to break her parents' hearts. from what i see, if your love for her was complete enough for you to really deserve her hand, you would care about this at least as much as she does. please think about this, because i think what i say is really an expression of a traditional way of looking at things in any relgion. traditions are traditional because they last a long time. and they last a long time because they are what works between people.

    if you push it and it comes to some kind of contest between you and her father, and if she really is a good woman, you will lose. and if she loses this battle inside and chooses you, everyone will lose, and that would be the proverbial brick wall with no seatbelt...by which i mean to say that it would surprise me very much that your marriage would survive over the long haul.

    so: what i would ask you to do my dear sir is to look again at your situation with very adult eyes. don't necessarily believe me...but listen well to what i have to reflect to you....i can only say that if i were in your situation i would end it immediately. i would tell her that i love her and respect her too much to continue doing this thing that doesn't honor the ones who have loved her and cared for her most, whose dreams have been interwoven with her since before she was conceived, who named her; and her mother who bore her in her body for 9 moons and gave birth to her in pain that you and i will never know.

    to me, to do this is simply manhood...a hard-won achievement to be sure. but if you were a father yourself and your heart was open to seeing what i see, i don't think you would be able to continue at all. not another minute.

    and God knows best
    peace to you my christian brother,
    hamid
    Last edited by hamid_al-murid; 18th April 2006 at 03:57.
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    Veteran Member vinod's Avatar
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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Opticyclic

    The traditional view that prohibits marriage between non-muslim man and woman comes from their approach to law making, known as usul-al-fiqh (principles of jurispridence). Ibahah ( presumption of permissibility) is the general norm in most realms like food, contracts etc but sexual interaction and <something else that I can't remember> are excepted. in other words, when it comes to marriage, traditional scholars take the approach that the default is a prohibition unless the Quran has explicitly permitted it. That is why the silence of the Quran on marriage between non-muslim man and woman is taken to be a prohibition. You can be sure that her father holds the traditional view of prohibition.

    Would there be issues in the two of you getting married? If her fear of her parent's reaction is any indication, then they are going to strongly disapprove. This can place great emotional pressure on your girlfriend. She may crack under that pressure and separate from you. Or she may persevere and still get married. If that happens, do you both have a plan for thr faith of your children? What about your parents' reaction to marrying a muslim girl? Will the families see eye-to-eye when they meet? There are lotsa issues there. I believe that you're girlfriend is facing a clash of priorities within herself and she can go either way about marrying you.

    For that matter, there are signs that you too are facing a conflict in the choice between her and her religion. Ideally, you would like her to leave her religion at her home. But you know you won't get that. She'll come with some of her religious tradition, if not all. Have you both thought well about all this? Where you can compromise and where you cannot?

    Lastly, proving to your girlfriend that it is permissible for a non-muslim man to marry a muslim woman is hardly going to be a help. There are more real issues at hand. And for someone like your girlfriend, who probably is well aware of what her religion says about dating, that proof is not going to swing her commitment to you. Think about it. I think she may be a person who is driven by her emotional attachments than intellectual/religious persuation.

    Was-salam
    Last edited by vinod; 18th April 2006 at 06:24.

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    Veteran Member MF's Avatar
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    Default Re: Christian Boy Marry Muslim Girl

    Quote Originally Posted by opticyclic
    I would feel less comfortable making a commitment to a different religion than I do with my current one.
    how do you feel about making a commitment to a muslim then? it seems that religion is above everything to religious people (above parents, children and partners) you are marrying her religion first and then her or not?
    “The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.” ~ Mahatma Gandhi

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