narration

[Hashim]

Aslaam Alaykum Warahmatualhee War'baraakaauuh

I pray and hope you are all in good health and emaan inshallaah.

I am requesting a hadeeth and full refernce inshallaah, the narration is regading the companion Abdullah Ibn Masud (radiallhuanhu). He came across some people in a mosque, they were sitting in groups, doingzikr, using stones. For each stone they threw they chanted Allaah Huakbar 100 times and then subhanallaah 100 times and so on. Basically thry were practising a innovated form of zikr which the prophet (sallalllaahu'alay'hee'wasalaam) mnor the companions practised. Abdullaah Ibn Masud stopped them and told them not to do it. I am requesting this narration if possible inshallaah'ta'allaah.

Wa'Alaykum'Salaam

[Islam4U]

Walaykum Assalam, Wa Rehmatulahi Wabarakatahu. I'll find this Hadith Insha'Allah and post it you.

[mohamed]

Walaykum Assalam, Wa Rehmatulahi Wabarakatahu. I'll find this Hadith Insha'Allah and post it you.

I think u mean this hadith, by the way i have never heard this hadith before, probably because its not consider reliable enough.

Start Quote
As for the mawquf report of Ibn Mas`ud that some adduce against the permissibility of collective dhikr in mosques, this report is inauthentic:


Amr ibn salmah said: We used to sit in front of Abdullah Ibn Masoud's house before the Fajr prayer, so that when he came out we would go with him to the Masjid. {one day} Abu Moosa al-Ash'aaree came and asked us: 'Did Abu Abdur Rahmaan (i.e. Ibn Masoud) leave yet? ' We answered: 'No.'

So Abu Moosa al-Ash'aaree sat with us waiting for him. When he came out, we all stood up. Abu Moosa told him: "Oh, Abu Abdur Rahmaan! I recently saw something in the Masjid which I deemed to be evil, but all praise is for Allah, I did see anything except good " Ibn Masoud then asked: "then What was it?"

Abu Moosa said: "You will see it if you stay alive. In the Masjid, I saw a group of people sitting in circles waiting for the Salââh. Each circle is led by a person. And every person in these circles carries small stones (pebbles).

The leader of a circle would say: "Say 'Allah-u Akbar' a hundred times" so they would repeat Allah-u Akbar a hundred times; then he says "Say 'Laa ilaaha illallaah', a hundred times" so they would say Laa ilaaha illallaah a hundred times; then he would say: "Say 'Subhaanallah', a hundred times", they will say Subhana Allah a hundred times.

Then Ibn Masoud said: "What did you tell them?"

He said: 'I didn't say anything, I waited to hear your opinion."

Abdullah Ibn Masoud said: "Could you not order them to count their evil deeds, and assured them of getting their rewards."

Then Abdullah Ibn Masoud went ahead and we accompanied him. As he approached one of the circles, he said: "What is this that you are doing?"

They said: "Oh! Abu Abdur Rahmaan, these are pebbles to count the number of times we say Allah-u Akbar, La ilaaha Illallah, and Subhaanallah."

He said: "Count your evil deeds, and I assure you that you are not going to lose anything of your rewards (Hasanat). Woe unto you, people of Muhammad, how quickly you go to destruction! Those are your Prophet's companions available, these are his clothes not worn out yet, and his pots are not broken yet. I swear by Whom my soul is in His Hands that you are either following a religion that is better than the Prophet's religion or you are opening a door of misguidance." They said: "We swear by Allah Almighty, oh, Abu Abdur Rahmaan, that we had no intention other than doing good deeds." He said: "So what? How many people wanted to do good deeds but never got to do them? The Prophet of Allah has told us about people who recited the Qur'ân with no effect on them other than the Qur'ân passing through their throats. [I.e. You are Khawarij]...


Al-Darimi in the Muqaddima of his Sunan, narrated from al-Hakam ibn al-Mubarak who narrates from `Amr ibn Salima al-Hamadani. This `Amr ibn Yahya ibn `Amr ibn Salama al- Hamadani is da`if. Ibn Ma`in saw him and said: "his narrations are worth nothing"; Ibn Kharrash: "he is not accepted; al-Dhahabi listed him among those who are weak and whose hadith is not retained in al-Du`afa' wal-Matrukin (p. 212 #3229), Mizan al-I`tidal (3:293), and al-Mughni fil-Du`afa' (2:491); and al-Haythami declared him weak (da`if) in Majma` al-Zawa'id, chapter entitled Bab al-`Ummal `ala al-Sadaqa.

Further, its authenticity was questioned by al-Suyuti in al-Hawi (2:31); al-Hifni in Fadl al-Tasbih wal-Tahlil as cited by al-Lacknawi, Sibahat al-Fikr (p. 25 and 42-43).

Further, it is belied by Imam Ahmad's narration in al-Zuhd from Abu Wa'il who said: "Those who claim that `Abd Allah [= Ibn Mas`ud] forbade dhikr [are wrong]: I never sat with him in any gathering except he made dhikr of Allah in it." Cited by al-Munawi in Fayd al-Qadir (1:457), al-Suyuti in Natijat al-Fikr fil-Jahri bil-Dhikr in al-Hawi, al-Nabulusi in Jam` al-Asrar (p. 66), al-Hifni in Fadl al-Tasbih wal- Tahlil as cited in al-Lacknawi, Sibahat al-Fikr (p. 25).

In addition, the Prophetic narrations affirming loud dhikr are sahih and innumerable, and definitely take precedence over a mawquf Companion-report even if we were hypothetically to consider it authentic.

Naysayers mention other pseudo-evidence against loud dhikr, all weak, such as the hadith "The best Dhikr is soft, and the best sustenance is what is sufficient," "One silent du`a is seventy times more superior than one loud du`a," and other da`if and maqtu` reports for which we are supposed to leave Qur'an and Sahih evidence and the understanding of the Imams!

A final note:

"It is better for one to mention Allah once, pray one prayer, or recite one Sura or the like of that with the state of the Shari`a of Muhammad SallAllahu `alayhi wa-Alihi wa-Sallam than to do it a thousand times with the blameworthy state which is intense thirst for this world and devotion to idle talk, and absorption in misguidance. Allah save us!" Shaykh `Arabi al-Darqawi.

Our Master, the light of our eyes, the treasure of this world, Mawlana al-Shaykh Nazim said in the talks titled FROM DUNYA TO MAWLA:

"First condition for protection is to believe in God, and second to continue worshipping. Run and put your prayer-carpet, pray, make Dhikr and glorify the Lord. No protection now except that. Even whole armies can't protect one single person.

"Angels glorify without tiring, and they are fed by it. The power of one angel is enough to carry away the power of whole mankind; that special power may stop everything in a moment. One spiritual person may carry away all nuclear weapons in one moment.

"We don't fear a nuclear war. It is not going to be as they like and think, because the control is in the hands of a wali. The world is under heavenly control. On every bomb there is a jinn. People think they are controlling, but they control nothing. There are the 5 Qutubs, and they control.

"Allah likes and orders to be glorified. It gives power and peace to you. Try to say more: La ilaha ill'Allah, say: ALLAH, ALLAH, make Salawat [invocations of blessings on the Prophet].

"Try to give more time of your day to reach to spiritual power. Every worshipping and Dhikr helps, giving you more love for the Lord, and real life comes through love. Saints say: people without love are like dead ones walking on earth.

"Love is life, light and our perfection. As much as your love is growing, you live more enjoyful, happy. The main purpose of tariqats is to train people to make Dhikr, so that they may take support and power from it.

"Time of Qiyama approaching now. Hundreds of signs appeared, and one of them is that people leave glorification of the Lord. And sufferings rain on them. Then they ask treatment by drugs.

"All illnesses go away by glorifying the Lord. Through your love for the Lord you will reach health, pleasure and happiness here and hereafter."

Was-Salam.

Hajj Gibril
GF Haddad

[abubakr]

asalamu alaykum

it is very interesting that the sufis such as gf haddad and keller use odd,weak and fabircated narrations to justify their aqeedah. but when anybody else uses just one naration they are quick to point out that "oh this is isolated, this doesnt exist in any of 6 books of hadith etc".

it just shows the double standards of the suffiyah. No hadith required to abandon this form of group dikr. it is a clear bida.

[Guest]

Salaam Mohamed

"We don't fear a nuclear war. It is not going to be as they like and think, because the control is in the hands of a wali. The world is under heavenly control. On every bomb there is a jinn. People think they are controlling, but they control nothing. There are the 5 Qutubs, and they control.

Care to elaborate on this a bit?

[mohamed]

Salaam Mohamed

Care to elaborate on this a bit?

I am not sure but i think he is saying that as long as they are righteous people on this earth God will protect the earth. Actually i think there is a hadith were moses says that as long as there is one living believer on earth, God will keep the earth alive for that one person.

Abu bakr, what are you afraid of all this zikr for?

I will show you some sudanese hadras. Go to this page , go to videos, then go to the hadra area at the bottom of the page(join the party) and click on the link. This is concerning the burhaniya tariqa which is sudanese.

http://burhaniya.info/intranet/I_welc_e.htm