some concerns for the forum

[xp²]

peace,

i've noticed recently that the forum is taking an increasingly long time to load, with many timeout errors etc.. i think this is because the forum which is coded in asp is being run on a ms access database, i believe so because ms access databases are not designed to handle large numbers of simultaneous connections. this combined with the other rather annoying nuances like redirection to main forum instead of the post you just replied to, and the lack of text formatting options like bold italics colors etc is well........... a mess! sorry i don't mean to sound like i'm whining or being too critical, but this is just my observation, and i say this here because i feel the situation needs to be assessed.

now first i will just give an example of a few features that we are missing out on, which are found on other popular forums (coded in php):

one click;

- smileys
- text color/size/font/bold/italics/etc..
- quoting
- image display/url linking
- numbered & bullet lists
- attachments of files (pictures, .zips, .txt, etc.)
- thread ratings

--

there is also the private messaging feature, and having the ability to write your own title under your name, aswell as avatars and dynamic signatures. lets not forget the polling option either!

sure, some of these features are not absolutely necessary to be able to get a message out, but the internet is evolving and there are certain expectations people have.. they may not need them but most will want them.

i realise that there is something like 16,000 posts and no one would want such a collection to goto waste.. also the fact that this Snitz Forum software cannot be converted to a better handled forum without a long, tedious and time consuming operation presents a major problem.

so what can be done? had i been in control and running everything, i would install a MySQL database onto the server the site is hosted on (if it hasn't been installed already [& its usually free]), then i would get myself a copy of a forum template/software that has been coded in php like phpBB or vBulletin* (which is excellent competitor out there at moment), and install it using the MySql database, which is all fairly simple and quick. then decorate it with a color scheme/theme that is pleasing to the eyes. so what about all the old posts? we can't lose such a valuable asset that took much time to get where it is today!? well... just as we have made several forum categories like 'general discussion' and 'interfaith dialogue' we make another category called archives or 'forum archive' and have it link to/redirect to this current (snitz forum) version so people can still read the old posts in the old (this current) format !!!

it may sound like alot of work needs to be done, but it is not! i seriously am concerned for the future of this forum. Ronnie i know you are probably the only one here who can actually get something done, i am urging you to seriously consider where this forum is heading. ask yourself some questions, do you think this forum will still be alive in a couple of years? i mean do you believe that this UI site and forum is here to stay? i believe you do, so think about this now.. what will this forum look like in 1 year? 2 years? 3 years? are you telling me that when all these other forums will be so technically evolved and superior and feature rich, that we will still be using this old forum writing out html codes to make a piece of text have color? lol the other forums are already so full of features that it makes this one look ancient.. and when they improve and add even more.. will we be classed as Jurassic? lol. seriously, though.. consider the long term implications, because i feel it is being put off, will there be a time when this forum is so far behind that it will need to be upgraded? it may not come soon.. but if it takes 3 years or 5 years or even 10 years.. that time will come no doubt.. and then will you lose all the posts? would it not be better to "lose" a little than lose alot? you would not be losing the posts.. but adding them to an archive which can be accessed by all, but would it not be better to do it sooner than later? i believe that the current state of the forum is doing more harm than good.

i guarantee you that no serious person would not want to have some of the features mentioned above.. heck even make a vote on here and ask everyone if they think its good or not.

if there is some problem preventing any sort of upgrade happening, tell me about it.. you can email me if you wish, and if i can help i most definately will.. if you don't have resources to get a server with the relevant database etc then i will even pay for the first year to get things rolling,, and i will set everything up myself if needs be.


please don't take my words the wrong way, i am only critisizing the house.. i come here for the residents only.

[vector]

xp I really appreciate your thoughts on this, and it means someone out there is atleast concerned regarding this. However the webmasters would be the best folks to decide on that combined with the UI web team. However I have following points of view in this regard

1. Is the cost of adding on new features really worth that requirement. Some features are good, others may not be as neccessary. I believe normally the simpler designs are the better ones and long lasting, provided the are addressing all the required technical and functional aspects

2. Having said that, we can move into a step by step evolution of the forum, like starting from the mods, instead of ripping everything apart and starting from scratch by modifying the underlying core tehcnology. I have seen many good forums designed using asp, so php can be a viable option but should not the only one . That would do more harm than good if there is a massive surgery

3. Most forum members come here due to the content of the topics, and not due to the features of the forum. I beleive our greatest asset is the data, and knowledge shared among the memebers, and preserving it in an elegant manner should be the top priority

In my opinion, we should first analyize the requirements, and then according to the requirments, build the solutions architecture. Technology employed just for the sake of being novel sometimes backdrafts in unexpected manners

[Vajradhara]

Namaste all,

i've noted the same thing, though i've come to a different conclusion, from what i've been able to tell, one of the hops near the site has been saturated with ftp requests... resulting in, for all intents and purposes, a denial of service attack. though i don't think that this site was the target.. just "collateral damage" as they like to say.

i completely agree... using MS Access is going to be an issue. the JET Engine, which is what drives the Access Databases, is limited to the amount of data that it can hold, more than is here now, but still limited. last time i checked, and it's been awhile, the JET engine was limited to 1gb of information and 255 user connections.

moving to a SQL based database would allow for scaleability of the system to meet the growing data storeage needs of the site.

VBulletin is pretty good forum software and supports a wide range of features and enhancements, should that be the direction.



~compassionately~

[xp²]

salaam,

- Vector

ofcourse its the webmaster and UI team that will be deciding on everything lol, i am merely looking for any possibility of improvement.. and if there is, i hope to be a catalyst and get things rolling if its needed.

in regards to your 1st point.. is the cost worth the new features, but i am wondering, what kind of costs there are? do you mean money or the time/process/labour ? also.. due to the nature of Snitz forum software.. there not much that can be modded.. and i don't see how taking small changes will be of any benefit.. if the final change is going to do over everything? anyway it will take one install and all the features and everything else will be in place.. then the small changes can be made like designing a forum logo, template.. and fine tuning the settings etc.

i understand the posts are the most valuable of all things here, but my point is to merely stress that if you put off changing/upgrading now.. will there be a time in the future when you will have to do a major upgrade and archive all the current posts? so in terms of thinking ahead.. would it not be better to archive the posts now.. than do it later when there is so much more (posts) ?

php doesn't have to be the only option, but serious consideration should be given to it.. since it is really efficient when used with a powerful database like mysql (or other similiar types), plus theres the benefit of being able to convert 'php coded, mysql db run' forums to other popular brands, like phpBB to vBulletin.. but can you do that with Snitz? lol

i think it is possible, but it requires alot of work.. it will mean getting the text files/data from one database and manually inserting it in to the tables of the new database, so it may just be a better option to link to an archive of old posts, so nothing is lost really.

-Vaj

have you seen the new version of vbulletin? i personally like the feel of the v2.3.x series, but that new version3 they released looks kinda bad, in my opinion.

[Vajradhara]

Salaam XP,

yep, we're running v3.0 Release Candidate over at comparative-religion.com

i rather like the look and feel of the v2.x flavors as well though i've noticed that the v3.0 software does load faster for most users.

~compassionately~