Elaborate with Wisdom

[hasan]

2:62
VERILY, those who have attained to faith (in this divine writ), as well as those who follow the Jewish faith, and the Christians, and the Sabians - all who believe in God and the last day and do righteous deeds - shall have their reward with their Sustainer; and no fear need they have, and neither shall they greive
2:111
AND THEY claim, "None shall ever enter paradise unless he be a Jew" -or, "a Christian". Such are their wishful beliefs! Say: "Produce an evidence for what you are claiming, if what you say is true!"
2:113
Furthermore, the Jews assert, "The Christians have no valid ground for their beliefs," while the Christians assert, "The Jews have no valid ground for their beliefs" - and both quote the divine writ! Even thus, like unto what they say, have (always) spoken those who were devoid of knowledge; but it is God who will judge between them on Resurrection Day with regard to all on which they were wont to differ.
2:120
For, never will the Jews be pleased with thee, nor yet the Christians, unless thou follow their own creeds. Say: "Behold, God's guidance is the only true guidance."
2:135
AND THEY say, "Be Jews" - or, "Christians" - and you shall be on the right path." Say: Nay, but (ours is) the creed of Abraham, who turned away from all that is false, and was not of those who ascribe divinity to aught beside God."
2:138
(Say: "Our life takes its) hue from God! And who could give better hue (to life) than God, if we but truly worship Him?"
2:140
"Do you claim that Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and their descendants were 'Jews' or 'Christians'?" Say: "Do you know more than God does?" And who could be more wicked than he who suppresses a testimony given to him by God? Yet God is not unmindful of what you do.
3:67
Abraham was neither a "Jew" nor a "Christian", but was one who turned away from all that is false, having surrendered himself unto God; and he was not of those who describe divinity to aught beside him.
5:7
And (always) remember the blessings which God has bestowed upon you, and the solemn pledge by which He bound you to himself when you said, "We have heard, and we pay heed." Hence remain conscious of God: verily, God has full knowledge of what is in the hearts (of men).
5:14
And (likewise,) from those who say, "Behold, we are Christians," We have accepted a solemn pledge: and they, have forgotten much of what they they had been told to bear in mind - wherefore We have given rise among them enmity and hatred,(to last) until Resurrection Day: and in time God will cause them to understand what they have contrived.
5:18
And (both) the Jews and the Christians say, "We are God's children, and His beloved ones." Say "Why, then, does He cause you to suffer for your sins? Nay , you are but Human beings of His creating. He forgives whom he wills and He causes to suffer whom He wills: for God's is the dominion over the heavens and the earth and all that is between them, and with Him is all journeys' end."
5:73
Indeed, the truth deny they who say, "Behold, God is the third of a trinity" - seeing that there is no deity whatever save the one God. Unless they desist from this assertiion, greivous suffering is bound to befall such of them as are bent on denying the truth.
5:74
Will they not, then, turn towards God in repentance, and ask His forgiveness? For God is much-forgiving, a dispenser of grace.
5:77
Say: "O followers of the Gospel! Do not overstep the bounds (of truth) in your religious beliefs; and do not follow the errant views of people who have gone astray aforetime, and have led many (others) astray, and are still straying from the right path"
22:17
Verily, as for those who have attained to faith (in this divine writ), and those who follow the Jewish faith, and the Sabians, and the Christians, and the Magians, (on the one hand,) and those who are bent on ascribing divinity to aught but God, (on the other,) verily, God will decide, between them on Resurrection Day: for, behold, God is witness to everything.




Hasan Demirkol

[Lamp Of Light]

Peace and truth be with you always Hasan,

2:62
VERILY, those who have attained to faith (in this divine writ), as well as those who follow the Jewish faith, and the Christians, and the Sabians - all who believe in God and the last day and do righteous deeds - shall have their reward with their Sustainer; and no fear need they have, and neither shall they greive

Comment : This is a well spoken truth. I agree 100%. We are not here to be called by mens labels, but rather we are here to specifically come to know God and love Him (once you know God you will love Him), and by so doing we will exhibit great faith and perform many righteous deeds(both visible and invisible). Amen.

2:111
AND THEY claim, "None shall ever enter paradise unless he be a Jew" -or, "a Christian". Such are their wishful beliefs! Say: "Produce an evidence for what you are claiming, if what you say is true!"

Yes, many jews , christians, and muslims all claim the other will not enter paradise unless the other carries their "label", but this is an absolute wicked thought. It seems all the religions have a real affinity for wanting to be master over the gates of the kingdom of heaven. They all seem at fault here to me. Once again, I agree 100% with this truth..it goes for them all. There is only one true religion, full belief/faith in our Lord God almighty, Creator of heaven and earth, and trusting in His eternal truth and loving kindness for all mankind. He loves us all and GOD DESIRES NOTHING MORE THEN FOR ALL OF US TO COME TO HIM IN LOVE AND TRUTH OF SPIRIT.

2:113
Furthermore, the Jews assert, "The Christians have no valid ground for their beliefs," while the Christians assert, "The Jews have no valid ground for their beliefs" - and both quote the divine writ! Even thus, like unto what they say, have (always) spoken those who were devoid of knowledge; but it is God who will judge between them on Resurrection Day with regard to all on which they were wont to differ.

Again, I agree 100% with what i ssaid here. Jews and Christians faith is interdependent. SO iti s a foolish Christian who says the jewish faith is unfounded, and it is a foolish jew who says the christian faith is unfounded. A christian wouldn't be a christian if Christ was not a jew, and the jews do not accept Christ was the messiah (because they do not understand or recognize their own writs of prophecy on the matter, or if they do, then we must assume Christ was not the messiah (and assuredly there is no doubt about the messiah). And as always, God knows the truth entirely of every issue and every mans heart.


2:120
For, never will the Jews be pleased with thee, nor yet the Christians, unless thou follow their own creeds. Say: "Behold, God's guidance is the only true guidance."

This is again true, and likewise holds for muslims as well. Gods guidance is available in many places and in many forms, however, we should utilize the scriptures if we really want to come to know God, for they supply us thousands of years of truth.

2:135
AND THEY say, "Be Jews" - or, "Christians" - and you shall be on the right path." Say: Nay, but (ours is) the creed of Abraham, who turned away from all that is false, and was not of those who ascribe divinity to aught beside God."

Well, I have a bit of a problem with this one. Let me explain; What he says is truth, but to the unwise it will leave them thinking the wrong thing. If you truly understand the qu'ran then you would recognize I am speakign the truth. First jews were given a way
to God, they were chosen among all men...then the messiah came, messiah is the gate to heaven, nobody is going to go to heaven that does not go through messiah (many christians do not truly understand what this means), then we have muslims....i am still wrestling with their religion, but it is clearly evident to me that there are men who seem to love God and seem to have come to understand God through Islam. I find most things of what muhammed says to be in line with the truth of God. I find very little fault, but I do find some fault, and some that I find seriously in conflict with my understandings of the truth. That which I have been pointing to since I came here and have seen it as I am learning about Islam. Muhammed states clearly, if I am not mistaken, that God has provided many paths to Him by which men can come.

2:138
(Say: "Our life takes its) hue from God! And who could give better hue (to life) than God, if we but truly worship Him?"


Amen.


2:140
"Do you claim that Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and their descendants were 'Jews' or 'Christians'?" Say: "Do you know more than God does?" And who could be more wicked than he who suppresses a testimony given to him by God? Yet God is not unmindful of what you do.

Neither were they any label but Gods children, as it is today and will always be. Thus we shall not deny the truth when we see it, nor shall we deny the testimonys that came before, or that yet might come, for God is ruler over all things, and no men will control what God wills. God will be glorified, and He will glorify himself.


3:67
Abraham was neither a "Jew" nor a "Christian", but was one who turned away from all that is false, having surrendered himself unto God; and he was not of those who describe divinity to aught beside him.

There is no label that men can call themselves that will ascribe for them a place in heaven, and there is no God but the one true God our Father. Amen.



5:7
And (always) remember the blessings which God has bestowed upon you, and the solemn pledge by which He bound you to himself when you said, "We have heard, and we pay heed." Hence remain conscious of God: verily, God has full knowledge of what is in the hearts (of men).

The key here is understanding who God is, and keeping your hearts true to Him. Amen. What you bind upon earth will be bound in heaven. Amen.

5:14
And (likewise,) from those who say, "Behold, we are Christians," We have accepted a solemn pledge: and they, have forgotten much of what they they had been told to bear in mind - wherefore We have given rise among them enmity and hatred,(to last) until Resurrection Day: and in time God will cause them to understand what they have contrived.

This is the same for all men, not just Christians. There are alot of muslims this applies to, and jews, and hindus...the label will not save you, the heart contains the full truth by which you shall be known. There is no rest for the wicked, it doesn't matter what label, creed, or religion they profess themselves.


5:18
And (both) the Jews and the Christians say, "We are God's children, and His beloved ones." Say "Why, then, does He cause you to suffer for your sins? Nay , you are but Human beings of His creating. He forgives whom he wills and He causes to suffer whom He wills: for God's is the dominion over the heavens and the earth and all that is between them, and with Him is all journeys' end."


I have a bit of a problem with this also, because the unwise can stumble over it. We are all Gods children, God even loves us all, but many of us fall away and take another father and become children of the devil instead. God will always take his children back, if they are true to Him. So we are all truly just human beings, but God does save people. He elects whom He will. So we become beloved when we do what pleases God, and when we are elected, we are still human beings, but with a new spirit that puts us in much greater alignment with the truth. We are commissioned and near to God in such cases, though surely we can seperate ourselves by disobedience, and it becomes a very grave matter when it is intentional.

5:73
Indeed, the truth deny they who say, "Behold, God is the third of a trinity" - seeing that there is no deity whatever save the one God. Unless they desist from this assertiion, greivous suffering is bound to befall such of them as are bent on denying the truth.


God is not the third of anything. He is one. The first and the last. The Alpha and the Omega. The Beginning and the End. Neither does the trinity doctrine itself claim God is a third of three, or third of a trinity. So either he is referring to some other trinity doctrine, or he does not understand the trinity doctrine as I understand it to mean. Perhaps that is his point, people did not understand the doctrine properly, and perhaps his point again in saying that there are true followers of christ who know what they are talkign about. I personally would not have made a trinity doctrine. For assuredly our God is one God, there is none other besides He.

5:74
Will they not, then, turn towards God in repentance, and ask His forgiveness? For God is much-forgiving, a dispenser of grace.

This we must all do, and Christ messiah is my intercession. Through him is victory for all men of truth.

5:77
Say: "O followers of the Gospel! Do not overstep the bounds (of truth) in your religious beliefs; and do not follow the errant views of people who have gone astray aforetime, and have led many (others) astray, and are still straying from the right path"


This is a serious problem for all men. The enemy of man has done his job well.


22:17
Verily, as for those who have attained to faith (in this divine writ), and those who follow the Jewish faith, and the Sabians, and the Christians, and the Magians, (on the one hand,) and those who are bent on ascribing divinity to aught but God, (on the other,) verily, God will decide, between them on Resurrection Day: for, behold, God is witness to everything.

Yes indeed He will, and we can all be comforted in knowing that his judgement is perfect for us all. Let us pray then for his mercy, for assuredly there is not one of us who is completely without sin !!! We attain for His perfection, and in His mercy we can be forgiven our true shortcomings, but it must be with all thy heart, all thy mind, all thy strength, all the time.

Peace and love in truth to you Hasan. Now I am going to make a confession in a new thread.

Blessed is the Lord our God!

Edited by - Lamp Of Light on 03/25/2004 13:51:31